Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: I -- I'm sorry if we've kept you waiting. Let me just begin by saying what a great pleasure it is for me to welcome President Obama again to my house, and to be able to meet all of you. 昂山素季女士：我——很抱歉让大家久等了。首先我想说，我非常高兴再次欢迎奥巴马总统来到我家，也很高兴能与大家见面。
I would just like to say that there have been those who have been saying that there is tension between the United States and the National League for Democracy -- or perhaps with me. I would like to make quite clear that the friendship between the United States and those who have been struggling for democracy in Burma is a very strong one. We may view things differently from time to time but it will in no way affect our friendship. 我想说的是，一直有人说美国和全国民主联盟之间——或者说和我之间——存在紧张关系。我想明确表示，美国与缅甸那些为民主奋斗的人士之间的友谊非常牢固。我们可能有时看法不同，但这绝不会影响我们的友谊。
And I have absolute confidence that the United States will continue to support us with regard to the democratic transformation and that when Burma becomes a fully functioning democracy in accordance with the will of the people, we will be able to say that among those friends who enabled us to get there, the United States was among the first. 我绝对相信，美国将继续支持我们的民主转型，当缅甸按照人民的意愿成为一个充分运作的民主国家时，我们将能够说，在帮助我们实现这一目标的朋友中，美国是最早的一批。
So please don't think -- please don't worry that there will be any problems between the United States and those working for democracy in Burma. We all believe in the same values. We all believe in the same principles. We may sometimes think that there are different ways of getting to the goal that we wish to achieve, but these differences are part of the democratic tradition. Democracy allows people to have different views, and democracy makes it also -- makes us also responsible for negotiating an answer to those views. 所以请不要认为——请不要担心美国和缅甸民主人士之间会有任何问题。我们都信奉同样的价值观。我们都信奉同样的原则。我们有时可能认为实现目标的方式不同，但这些差异是民主传统的一部分。民主允许人们有不同的观点，民主也让我们——让我们也有责任通过谈判找到解决这些分歧的办法。
I would like all of you to feel welcome in this country, and I would all -- like all of you to feel that you can join us in hoping for better days. But at the same time, I always warn against over-optimism because that could lead to complacency. 我希望大家在这个国家都能感到受欢迎，我也希望大家都能感受到，你们可以和我们一起期待更美好的日子。但与此同时，我总是提醒大家不要过度乐观，因为那会导致自满。
Our reform process is going through, let's us say, a bumpy...patch. But this bumpy patch is something that we can negotiate with commitment and with the help and understanding of our friends from all over the world. So let us not exaggerate the differences, the difficulties. But at the same time, let us not exaggerate the rosy picture either. 我们的改革进程正在经历，让我们说，一段崎岖的……时期。但这段崎岖时期是我们可以通过承诺，以及世界各地朋友的帮助和理解来度过的。所以让我们不要夸大分歧、夸大困难。但同时，也让我们不要把局面描绘得过于美好。
What we need is a healthy balance between optimism and pessimism. We need to view the -- the situation for what it was. But at the same time, we all have to be confident that we will get there -- we will get where we want to get to, because that's what our people want. In the end, it's the people of Burma who will decide where this country is going to and which way and how and when. 我们需要的是乐观与悲观之间的健康平衡。我们需要实事求是地看待局势。但同时，我们都必须有信心，我们会到达那里——我们会到达我们想要到达的地方，因为这是我们人民的愿望。归根结底，是缅甸人民将决定这个国家的走向、走哪条路、如何走以及何时走。
So we accept responsibility for the fate of our country, but at the same time we welcome the support and the help of our friends. And we always appreciate them very greatly. 所以我们对国家的命运承担责任，但同时我们欢迎朋友们的支持和帮助。我们一直非常感激他们。
Thank you. 谢谢大家。
Barack Obama: Well, good afternoon, everybody. Mingalaba. It is wonderful to be back in Rangoon and to once more have the opportunity to spend time with Aung San Suu Kyi. As we know, it was in this house that she endured years of confinement -- never giving up hope, never wavering in her determination to build a free and democratic Burma. Daw Suu, you helped set this country on a better path. I'm grateful for your friendship and for the hospitality that you've shown in opening your home up not only to me, but to all these people. 巴拉克·奥巴马：大家下午好。敏格拉巴。很高兴再次回到仰光，并有机会再次与昂山素季共度时光。我们知道，正是在这所房子里，她经受了多年的软禁——从未放弃希望，从未动摇建设一个自由民主缅甸的决心。素季女士，您帮助这个国家走上了一条更好的道路。我感谢您的友谊，也感谢您的盛情款待，您不仅向我敞开了家门，也向所有这些人敞开了大门。
When I made my first historic visit to Burma, this country was just taking preliminary steps towards democracy. And in the past two years, important changes have been made. The economy has begun to grow. Political prisoners have been set free. There are more newspapers and media outlets. Children have been released from the military. And these are all important changes that have opened up greater opportunity for the people of Burma. 当我第一次对缅甸进行历史性访问时，这个国家刚刚迈出走向民主的初步步伐。在过去两年里，已经发生了重要的变化。经济开始增长。政治犯获释。报纸和媒体越来越多。儿童兵已被释放。这些都是重要的变化，为缅甸人民打开了更大的机遇之门。
At the same time, as Aung San Suu Kyi just said, it's clear how much hard work remains to be done and that many difficult choices still lie ahead. The process for reform is by no means complete or irreversible. For many, progress has not come fast enough or spread far enough. People need to feel safe in their homes and not be subject to arbitrary harassment by authorities or individuals acting with impunity. People need to be empowered to pursue their dreams. 同时，正如昂山素季刚才所说，显然还有大量艰苦的工作要做，前方仍有许多艰难的选择。改革进程还远未完成，也不是不可逆转的。对许多人来说，进展来得不够快，也不够广泛。人们需要在家中感到安全，而不是受到当局或个人的任意骚扰而不受惩罚。人们需要有追求梦想的能力。
And as Burma approaches important national elections next year, it will be critical to ensure that all of Burma's people can participate in shaping the future of their country. 随着缅甸明年迎来重要的全国选举，确保缅甸全体人民都能参与塑造国家的未来将至关重要。
As a member of parliament and the head of the rule of law committee, Aung San Suu Kyi is working hard to make government more transparent, more accountable, to protect the rights of all the Burmese people, to promote reforms that would expand the political space for more people to contribute their voices. 作为国会议员和法治委员会主席，昂山素季正在努力使政府更加透明、更负责任，保护全体缅甸人民的权利，推动能够扩大政治空间、让更多人发出声音的改革。
But implementing the major political and economic reforms that are necessary to keep Burma advancing toward democracy is going to take a great deal of political will and no small amount of determination. And we, as friends of the Burmese people, are clear-eyed about the scale of the challenges that remain, and recognize that we cannot remain complacent. 但实施缅甸迈向民主所需的重大政治和经济改革，需要巨大的政治意愿和坚定的决心。作为缅甸人民的朋友，我们对仍然存在的挑战有着清醒的认识，也认识到我们不能自满。
Today, Daw Suu and I had a wide-ranging discussion about how the United States can help facilitate and bolster Burma's democratic transition. We talked about the need for stronger rule of law, for elections that are free, fair and inclusive, and for continued constitutional changes that will move Burma more fully towards a civilian government. 今天，我和素季女士进行了广泛的讨论，探讨美国如何帮助促进和支持缅甸的民主转型。我们谈到了加强法治的必要性，谈到了自由、公正和包容的选举，以及继续进行宪法改革，使缅甸更全面地走向文官政府。
We spoke about how we can work together to promote national reconciliation and defuse sectarian tensions among Burma's diverse ethnic groups. Specifically, I stressed the need to find durable and effective solutions for the terrible violence in Rakhine state -- solutions that end discrimination, provide greater security and economic opportunities, protect all citizens, and promote greater tolerance and understanding. Strengthening human rights protections for all of Burma's people is an essential step to realizing the vision we share for the future of this beautiful country. 我们谈到了如何共同努力促进民族和解，化解缅甸各民族之间的教派紧张关系。具体而言，我强调需要为若开邦的可怕暴力找到持久有效的解决方案——这些解决方案要结束歧视，提供更大的安全和经济机会，保护所有公民，促进更大的宽容和理解。加强对全体缅甸人民的人权保护，是实现我们对这个美丽国家未来共同愿景的关键一步。
The last time I stood here, I made a pledge to the people of Burma -- that if we continued to see progress toward reform, the ties between our countries would grow stronger, and the United States would continue to do whatever it could to help ensure Burma's success. Over the last two years, I think we've made good on that pledge, and I want to reiterate the commitment to match continued reforms with greater support and friendships in the future. 我上次站在这里时，曾向缅甸人民承诺——如果我们继续看到改革的进展，我们两国之间的关系将会加强，美国将继续尽其所能帮助确保缅甸的成功。在过去两年里，我认为我们兑现了这一承诺，我想重申，我们将在未来以更大的支持和友谊来配合持续的改革。
We're committed to working directly with the people of Burma, and not just the government. So later today, I'm looking forward to speaking with representatives of Burma's civil society groups and with young leaders from Burma and all across Southeast Asia who are working to create greater opportunities for themselves and for future generations. I think these new voices are going to be critical to making sure that reforms are sustainable and meaningful to people across the country and across the region. 我们致力于直接与缅甸人民合作，而不仅仅是与政府合作。因此，今天晚些时候，我期待着与缅甸民间社会团体的代表，以及来自缅甸和整个东南亚的青年领袖交谈，他们正在努力为自己和子孙后代创造更多机会。我认为这些新的声音对于确保改革是可持续的、对全国和全地区人民有意义的，将是至关重要的。
So, Daw Suu, thank you again for welcoming us here today. We continue to look to you for inspiration as well as resolve, and I know that you will continue to be a fierce advocate on behalf of the people of Burma, a future of democracy, and I know that you will be a strong partner with the United States. 所以，素季女士，再次感谢您今天欢迎我们来到这里。我们继续从您身上汲取灵感和决心，我知道您将继续作为缅甸人民、民主未来的坚定倡导者，我也知道您将是美国的坚强伙伴。
Thank you. Questions? 谢谢大家。有问题吗？
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: Who's speaking? 昂山素季女士：谁来提问？
Barack Obama: I'll go first. Christi Parsons. 巴拉克·奥巴马：我先来吧。克里斯蒂·帕森斯。
Q: You have been traveling in countries with long histories of repressing freedom of expression and censorship. And it was interesting yesterday that President Xi seemed to be saying that reporters who have problems have themselves to blame. And so I wonder to what extent you feel the need to contend with these ideas with leaders in this region as you travel. And what do you say to them? 问：您一直在访问那些有着长期压制言论自由和审查制度历史的国家。有意思的是，昨天习主席似乎在说，那些有问题的记者只能怪他们自己。所以我想知道，您在多大程度上觉得有必要在访问该地区时与这些领导人就这些想法进行交锋。您对他们怎么说？
And by way of example, I might ask you -- Attorney General Eric Holder says no journalist will go to prison for doing his or her job, on his watch. And so I ask about the case of James Risen, the journalist who is facing this prosecution for not revealing his source in a leak prosecution. I wonder if that's -- are you speaking specifically about this case, and is that your position as well? 举个例子，我可能会问您——司法部长埃里克·霍尔德说，在他任内，不会有记者因为履行职责而入狱。所以我想问詹姆斯·里森的案子，这位记者因在一桩泄密案中拒绝透露消息来源而面临起诉。我想知道那是不是——您是在具体谈论这个案子吗，这也是您的立场吗？
And if I may, Daw Aung San Suu Kyi, ask you -- how concerned are you about the violence against ethnic minorities in your country, and specifically the Rohingya people? And what do you believe is your responsibility to speak out about it? Thank you very much. 另外，如果可以的话，昂山素季女士，我想问您——您对贵国针对少数民族的暴力，特别是罗兴亚人的问题有多担忧？您认为您有什么责任就此发声？非常感谢。
Barack Obama: The issue of press freedom is a constant concern in my interactions with the Chinese government. It's an issue that I've raised with the President here in Burma. I'm pretty blunt and pretty frank about the fact that societies that repress journalists ultimately oppress people as well, and that if you want a society that is free and vibrant and successful, part of that formula is the free flow of information, of ideas, and that requires a free press. That is part of our tradition. 巴拉克·奥巴马：新闻自由问题是我与中国政府交往中始终关注的问题。这也是我向缅甸总统提出的问题。我非常坦率地表明，压制记者的社会最终也会压迫人民，如果你想要一个自由、充满活力和成功的社会，其中的一部分就是信息和思想的自由流动，而这需要新闻自由。这是我们传统的一部分。
As I explained to President Xi in China, it's in our DNA. We believe in the primacy individuals being able to pursue their dreams, endowed with certain inalienable rights. And we believe that when governments censor or control information, that ultimately that undermines not only the society, but it leads to eventual encroachments on individual rights as well. 正如我在中国向习主席解释的那样，这是我们的基因。我们相信个人有权追求自己的梦想，享有某些不可剥夺的权利。我们认为，当政府审查或控制信息时，最终不仅会破坏社会，还会导致对个人权利的逐步侵犯。
I can't comment, Christi, on any particular pending case, as you know -- that's sort of an iron-clad rule -- or any particular prosecution. I can read back to you what Attorney General Holder has said, which is no journalist is going to go to jail for doing their job. And I don't think you're suggesting that there's -- that the two cases are comparable. But I recognize that in our own society we have to constantly balance the need for certain national security issues to remain secret with journalists pursuing leads wherever they can. 克里斯蒂，我不能对任何未决案件发表评论，你知道的——这是一条铁律——也不能对任何具体的起诉发表评论。我可以给你念一下霍尔德司法部长说过的话，那就是不会有记者因为履行职责而入狱。我不认为你是在说这两个案子有可比性。但我认识到，在我们自己的社会中，我们必须不断平衡某些国家安全问题保密的需要与记者追查线索的需要。
And the good news is, is that we've got courts and we've got a First Amendment. And we got a whole bunch of tools to ensure that that balance is properly debated and adjudicated. 好消息是，我们有法院，我们有第一修正案。我们有很多工具来确保这种平衡得到适当的辩论和裁决。
But I think that when I am traveling, it is important as the President of the United States to not just talk about our interests, but also to talk about our values. Sometimes it has an impact; sometimes it doesn't. Although I was impressed that Mark Landler got an answer to his question from President Xi. It might not have been the one he was expecting, but he did end up taking the question. So you just keep on chipping away and seeing if we can make progress. 但我认为，当我出访时，作为美国总统，重要的是不仅要谈论我们的利益，还要谈论我们的价值观。有时会有影响，有时则没有。不过，马克·兰德勒从习主席那里得到了对他问题的回答，这让我印象深刻。答案可能不是他所期望的，但他确实得到了提问的机会。所以你只要继续努力，看看我们能不能取得进展。
Q: [Off-mic inaudible] 问：（麦克风外听不清）
Barack Obama: Hold on a second, Christi. Don't try to segue into a second question. 巴拉克·奥巴马：等一下，克里斯蒂。别想顺势问第二个问题。
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: I think I better take over because I've got to have my time as well. 昂山素季女士：我想我该接手了，因为我也得有我的时间。
Barack Obama: There you go. 巴拉克·奥巴马：好的。
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: The National League for Democracy always has been against violence of any kind, either on racial grounds, or religious grounds, or ideological grounds. We do not believe that violence really resolves anything at all. 昂山素季女士：全国民主联盟一直反对任何形式的暴力，无论是基于种族、宗教还是意识形态的。我们不相信暴力能真正解决任何问题。
Our struggle for democracy has been carried out with a strong grasp on the principle of nonviolence. And also, we believe in the rule of law. So if you ask how do we propose to resolve all of these problems of violence between communities, between different ethnic groups, we've got to start with rule of law. People have to feel secure before they can start talking to one another. We cannot achieve harmony without security. People who feel threatened are not going to sit down and sort out their problems. 我们为民主而奋斗的过程，始终牢牢把握着非暴力原则。而且，我们信仰法治。所以如果你问我们打算如何解决所有这些社区之间、不同民族之间的暴力问题，我们必须从法治开始。人们必须有安全感，才能开始彼此对话。没有安全，我们就无法实现和谐。感到受威胁的人不会坐下来解决他们的问题。
So I would like to recommend, as the chair of the Rule of Law and Tranquility Committee -- don't forget that tranquility is also included -- that the government should look to rule of law. It is the duty of the government to make all our people feel secure, and it is the duty of our people to learn to live in harmony with one another. 作为法治与安宁委员会的主席——别忘了安宁也包括在内——我想建议政府应该着眼于法治。政府有责任让我们所有人民感到安全，而我们人民有责任学会彼此和谐相处。
If we want democracy, we have to be prepared to live by the principles of democracy. We have to dare to live according to the principles of democracy. I think we'll get there, but it will take us some time. But we will remain fully committed to the principle of nonviolence. 如果我们想要民主，我们就必须准备好按照民主原则生活。我们必须敢于按照民主原则生活。我认为我们会实现目标，但需要一些时间。但我们将继续完全致力于非暴力原则。
Q: [inaudible] Mr. President, I'd like to know about the Myanmar reforms. You've been talking with the President and parliament speakers, and also you're going to talk with the civil societies group, and then youth. So my direct question to you is that: Have you got any specific agreement with the Myanmar government or President Thein Sein about Myanmar reforms such as constitutional change, and peace negotiation, peace process, and also 2015 general election? 问：（听不清）总统先生，我想了解缅甸改革的情况。您一直在与总统和议会议长会谈，您还将与民间社会团体以及青年会谈。所以我直接的问题是：您与缅甸政府或登盛总统就缅甸改革问题，比如宪法修改、和谈、和平进程以及2015年大选，有没有达成任何具体协议？
And also to Daw Aung San Sui Kyi, you have got a one-hour discussion with the President, and at the current political situation, as you said, it's a bumpy situation. So if you didn't make amendment, or you didn't change constitution, the NLD and you, yourself, is going to be very difficult after 2015 elections. So have you talked about those issues with the President? Or the President talk to you about U.S. support for you? Thank you. 还有昂山素季女士，您与总统进行了一小时的会谈，就当前的政治局势而言，正如您所说，这是一个崎岖的局面。所以如果您不修改宪法，全民盟和您本人在2015年选举后将非常困难。那么您是否与总统讨论了这些问题？或者总统是否与您谈到了美国对您的支持？谢谢。
Barack Obama: Well, the issue of making sure that reforms and the transition is fully realized was the main topic of our conversation and the main topic of my conversation with the President last night. 巴拉克·奥巴马：确保改革和转型完全实现的问题，是我们会谈的主题，也是我昨晚与总统会谈的主题。
As I indicated before, there are signs of progress. We shouldn't deny that Burma today is not the same as Burma five years ago. But the process is still incomplete. And I was very specific with the President in terms of how we will measure whether or not the transition has been fully realized. 正如我之前所说，有一些进展的迹象。我们不应该否认，今天的缅甸已经不同于五年前的缅甸。但这个进程仍然不完整。我向总统非常具体地说明了我们将如何衡量转型是否已经完全实现。
Number one, we expect elections to take place on time. We do not want to see delays, because it's time for the voice of the people of Burma to be heard in a fair, free, transparent election. 第一，我们期望选举按时举行。我们不希望看到拖延，因为是时候让缅甸人民的声音在一场公平、自由、透明的选举中被听到了。
Number two, I indicated to the President that the constitution amendment process needs to reflect inclusion rather than exclusion, that there are certain provisions in the Burmese constitution that objectively don't make much sense. Ultimately, what changes are made are up to the people of Burma. But, for example, I don't understand a provision that would bar somebody from running for President because of who their children are. That doesn't make much sense to me. 第二，我向总统表示，宪法修改进程需要体现包容而非排斥，缅甸宪法中的某些条款客观上说不太合理。归根结底，做出什么样的修改取决于缅甸人民。但是，举个例子，我不理解一项会因为某人的孩子是谁而禁止其竞选总统的条款。这对我来说说不通。
Number three, we are very much in favor of the peace process, and I encourage the President to move forward in the negotiations. He expressed some optimism about the ability to bring a deal to a conclusion. But as Daw Suu has indicated, you have to be skeptical until it's actually done. 第三，我们非常支持和平进程，我鼓励总统推进谈判。他对达成协议表示了一些乐观。但正如素季女士所指出的，在真正完成之前，你必须持怀疑态度。
Number four, I indicated that we are paying attention to how religious minorities are treated in this country. Now, I recognize the complexities of the situation in Rakhine state. On the other hand, consistent with what Daw Suu just said, I am a firm believer that any legitimate government has to be based on rule of law and a recognition that all people are equal under the law. And discrimination against the Rohingya or any other religious minority I think does not express the kind of country that Burma over the long term wants to be. 第四，我表示我们正在关注这个国家对待宗教少数群体的方式。我承认若开邦局势的复杂性。另一方面，与素季刚才所说的一致，我坚信任何合法政府都必须建立在法治和法律面前人人平等的基础上。我认为，歧视罗兴亚人或任何其他宗教少数群体，并不符合缅甸从长远来看想要成为的那种国家。
And I know of no successful democracy in which sectarian or religious divisions are allowed to fester, or the people of different faiths are treated as second-class citizens. Ultimately, that is destabilizing to a democracy. 而且我不知道有哪个成功的民主国家会允许教派或宗教分歧恶化，或者让不同信仰的人被视为二等公民。归根结底，这对民主是不稳定的。
And finally, I expressed to the President the need to continue to make additional progress on basic issues of freedom and personal security, that journalists can't be jailed simply because they were critical of the government; that arbitrary arrests or individuals being in some fashion abused by government with impunity rather than being respected and treated in accordance with law, that that's a test of whether or not a society is moving towards a genuine democratic process. 最后，我向总统表示，需要继续在自由和人身安全等基本问题上取得更多进展，记者不能仅仅因为批评政府而入狱；任意逮捕或个人以某种方式受到政府虐待而不受惩罚，而不是受到尊重并依法对待，这些都是一个社会是否正在走向真正民主进程的考验。
And the President yesterday acknowledged that some progress has been made, and there was more to do. And our position will be to continue to measure what's happening on the ground, to consult with a wide range of groups here in Burma. 总统昨天承认，已经取得了一些进展，还有更多工作要做。我们的立场是，继续衡量实地发生的情况，与缅甸的广泛团体协商。
We will strengthen our relationship where we see progress. Where we don't see progress, then we will continue to express our concerns, and we will not be able to fully realize the kind of bilateral relationship that we want to have with Burma, the Burmese government, until we've seen some of these reforms completed. 我们将在看到进展的地方加强我们的关系。在我们看不到进展的地方，我们将继续表达我们的关切，在我们看到其中一些改革完成之前，我们将无法充分实现我们希望与缅甸、与缅甸政府建立的那种双边关系。
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: Well, you asked whether it's going to be fruitful for the NLD to win the elections if the amendments to the constitution are not pushed through. I think it's too early to ask this question. We've just spent one afternoon debating the question of constitutional amendment. I think perhaps some of you may have heard that proportional representation is not going to be instituted. 昂山素季女士：嗯，你问如果宪法修正案不能通过，全民盟赢得选举是否会有成效。我认为现在问这个问题还为时过早。我们刚花了一个下午辩论宪法修改的问题。我想也许你们中有些人已经听说，比例代表制不会被实行。
So when we started defending [inaudible] system against proportional representation, there were many who said to us, you are a very small minority in the legislature; how can you hope to win this case? It's not a matter of wanting to win a case, it's a matter of standing up for what you believe in, for what you believe is necessary for the future of our country. 所以当我们开始为比例代表制辩护时，很多人对我们说，你们在立法机构中是非常小的少数派，你们怎么能指望赢得这个案子呢？这不是想要赢得一个案子的问题，而是为你所信仰的、你认为对国家未来必要的事情挺身而出的问题。
Now we are asking for a constitutional amendment not because we're trying to win a case, but because we think that certain amendments are necessary if this country is to be a truly functioning democracy in line with the will of the people. Because of that, we will persist in our efforts to have the constitution amended in the right way and within the framework of the law. I've always put great emphasis on this because I want peace and tranquility in our country. I want our people to learn to live under the rule of law, and to support and uphold the importance of the rule of law. 现在我们要求修改宪法，不是因为我们想赢得一个案子，而是因为我们认为，如果这个国家要成为一个真正符合人民意愿的正常运转的民主国家，某些修改是必要的。正因为如此，我们将继续努力，以正确的方式、在法律框架内修改宪法。我一直非常强调这一点，因为我希望我们的国家和平与安宁。我希望我们的人民学会在法治下生活，支持和维护法治的重要性。
So with regard to the constitution, we know that the people support our wish to amend it in certain ways, and we are prepared to negotiate with those who do not wish to amend the constitution. I think that's what democracy is all about. We need a culture of negotiated compromise as the foundation for our democratic union. 所以关于宪法，我们知道人民支持我们在某些方面修改宪法的愿望，我们准备与那些不希望修改宪法的人进行谈判。我认为这就是民主的全部意义。我们需要一种谈判妥协的文化，作为我们民主联盟的基础。
So we would like to -- it's not just a matter of debating the case in parliament and winning Brownie points or Boy Scout points, or whatever they're called. But it's just a case of standing up for what we think our country needs. And we would like to talk to those who disagree with us. That, again, is what democracy is about. You talk to those who disagree with you; you don't beat them down. You exchange views. And you come to a compromise, a settlement that would be best for the country. 所以我们想要——这不仅仅是在议会中辩论案子、赢得加分或童子军积分之类的事情。这是一个为我们认为国家需要的事情挺身而出的问题。我们愿意与那些不同意我们的人对话。再说一次，这就是民主的意义所在。你与不同意你的人交谈；你不打倒他们。你们交换意见。然后达成妥协，达成对国家最有利的解决方案。
I've always said that dialogues and debates are not aimed at achieving victory for one particular party or the other, but victory for our people as a whole. Whatever we decide on should be seen as a victory for our nation, for the kind of democratic union that we have been trying to build up for decades. 我一直说，对话和辩论的目的不是为了某一方取得胜利，而是为了我们全体人民的胜利。无论我们做出什么决定，都应该被视为我们国家的胜利，是我们几十年来一直努力建立的那种民主联盟的胜利。
So please don't worry about whether or not we will win the elections in 2015. Of course, any party wants to win the elections. I'm sure the President will tell you that. But winning is not everything -- it's how you win. I'd rather lose than win in the wrong way. And that is the way I want our party and our people to approach the problems that we have to tackle -- that we want to win in the right way. We want to bring the changes of the constitution about in the right way. 所以请不要担心我们是否会赢得2015年的选举。当然，任何政党都想赢得选举。我相信总统也会这么告诉你。但胜利不是一切——关键是你如何获胜。我宁愿输也不愿以错误的方式赢。这就是我希望我们的党和我们的人民对待我们必须解决的问题的方式——我们想要以正确的方式获胜。我们想要以正确的方式实现宪法的变革。
We want to build up a strong foundation for national reconciliation, which means reconciliation not just between the different ethnic groups and between different religious groups, but between different ideas -- for example, between the idea of military supremacy and the idea of civilian authority over the military, which is the foundation of democracy. 我们想要为民族和解打下坚实的基础，这意味着不仅是不同民族之间和不同宗教团体之间的和解，还有不同思想之间的和解——比如，军事至上的思想与文官掌控军队的思想之间的和解，而后者是民主的基础。
So we want to exchange views and to come to an understanding with all those who at this moment do not yet agree with us. And we are confident that we can come to such a settlement, come to such an agreement because, after all, I do believe that what all of us want is what is best for the country as a whole -- not just for particular individuals or groups or organizations. 所以我们想要交换意见，与所有目前还不同意我们的人达成理解。我们有信心能够达成这样的解决方案，达成这样的协议，因为归根结底，我确实相信我们所有人想要的都是对整个国家最有利的——而不仅仅是对特定的个人、团体或组织。
So while I tell you that you need not worry about what affects amendment or non-amendment to the constitution might have on the elections, I might as well ask you to vote for us when we do get there. 所以，虽然我告诉你们不必担心宪法修改或不修改会对选举产生什么影响，我也不妨请你们在我们参选时投票给我们。
Barack Obama: Pete Maer. 巴拉克·奥巴马：皮特·梅尔。
Q: Mr. President, it seems the stage is set for even more confrontations between you and Republicans when you get home, if that's possible. We're told that you're soon going to sign the immigration reform executive order. To what extent are you concerned about a Republican backlash from an action of that magnitude? 问：总统先生，看起来您回国后与共和党人之间的对抗甚至会更多——如果还有可能的话。我们听说您很快就要签署移民改革行政命令。您在多大程度上担心共和党对如此重大行动的强烈反对？
And on two other issues, I'm wondering what your take is on the plan to pass a bill to build the Keystone pipeline that's in the works now, before the State Department's review process is over. And Senator McConnell is angry over the climate deal that you had made with China. How does all of this square with your post-election assessment that people want to, as you put it, get stuff done? 还有两个问题，我想知道您对目前正在制定的、在国务院审查程序结束前通过Keystone输油管道法案的计划有什么看法。麦康奈尔参议员对您与中国达成的气候协议感到愤怒。所有这些与您选举后关于人民想要，用您的话说，"把事情做成"的评估如何吻合？
And if I may also pose a question to you, Daw Aung San Suu Kyi. Thank you for hosting all of us here from the White House media corps. As the President mentioned of the constitutional barring of you running in your country's election, what do you think the impact will be from the President's statement that was made here today on his strong opposition to that constitutional wording? And what impact do you think it will have on the government here? And is there anything more that you'd like to see him do? Thank you. 另外，昂山素季女士，我也想向您提一个问题。感谢您在这里接待我们白宫记者团。正如总统提到的宪法禁止您参加贵国选举的问题，您认为总统今天在这里强烈反对这一宪法措辞的声明会产生什么影响？您认为这会对这里的政府产生什么影响？您还有什么希望他做的更多的事情吗？谢谢。
Barack Obama: Pete, the day after the election I said that there are going to be areas of agreement between me and Republicans, and there are going to be areas of disagreement. There are going to be actions I take they don't like, and there are going to be bills they pass that I don't like. 巴拉克·奥巴马：皮特，选举后的第二天我说过，我和共和党人之间会有达成一致的领域，也会有存在分歧的领域。会有我采取的他们不喜欢的行动，也会有他们通过的我不喜欢的法案。
And I think, moving forward, that's exactly what's going to happen. You've mentioned areas where we disagree. I believe that America is a nation of immigrants. Everybody agrees that the system is broken. There has been ample opportunity for Congress to pass a bipartisan immigration bill that would strengthen our borders, improve the legal immigration system, lift millions of people out of the shadows so they are paying taxes and getting right by the law. 我认为，展望未来，这正是将要发生的事情。你提到了我们存在分歧的领域。我相信美国是一个移民国家。每个人都认为这个系统已经坏了。国会有充分的机会通过一项两党移民法案，加强我们的边境，改善合法移民制度，让数百万人走出阴影，这样他们就能纳税并遵守法律。
It passed out of the Senate. I gave the House over a year to go ahead and at least give a vote to the Senate bilaterally; they failed to do so. And I indicated to Speaker Boehner several months ago that if, in fact, Congress failed to act, I would use all the lawful authority that I possess to try to make the system work better. And that's going to happen. That's going to happen before the end of the year. 法案已经在参议院通过了。我给了众议院一年多的时间，至少对参议院的法案进行一次投票；他们没有做到。我几个月前就向博纳议长表示，如果国会真的不采取行动，我将动用我拥有的一切合法权力，努力让这个系统运转得更好。这将会发生。这将在年底前发生。
But what I've also said to them -- and I said this during the lunch with the Speaker and Leader McConnell -- is that I am always interested in negotiating a legislative solution to the immigration problem, and that the minute they pass a bill that I can sign that fixes our immigration system, then any executive actions I take are replaced. 但我也对他们说过——我在与议长和麦康奈尔领袖共进午餐时也说过——我一直有兴趣通过谈判找到移民问题的立法解决方案，一旦他们通过一项我能签署的法案来修复我们的移民系统，我采取的任何行政行动都将被取代。
So they have the ability to fix the system. What they don't have the ability to do is to expect me to stand by with a broken system in perpetuity. 所以他们有能力修复这个系统。他们没有能力做的是指望我永远袖手旁观看着一个坏掉的系统。
And I would advise that if, in fact, they want to take a different approach, rather than devote a lot of time trying to constrain my lawful actions as the Chief Executive of the U.S. government in charge of our enforcing our immigration laws, that they spend some time passing a bill and engaging with all the stakeholders, the immigrant rights groups, the law enforcement groups, the evangelicals, the business community, all of whom have said this is something that needs to be done, is way overdue. 我建议，如果他们真的想采取不同的方法，与其花大量时间试图限制我作为美国行政首长、负责执行我们移民法的合法权力，不如花点时间通过一项法案，与所有利益相关方接触——移民权利团体、执法团体、福音派人士、商界——所有这些人都说这件事需要做，早就该做了。
And we've been talking about it for 10 years now, and it's been consistently stalled. 我们已经谈了10年了，一直被拖延。
So with respect to Keystone, I've been clear in the past, Pete, my position hasn't changed, that this is a process that is supposed to be followed. Right now you have a case pending in Nebraska, where the pipeline would run through, in which a state court judge has questioned the plan. And until we know what the route is, it's very hard to finish that evaluation. And I don't think we should short-circuit that process. 所以关于Keystone，皮特，我过去已经说得很清楚了，我的立场没有改变，那就是这是一个应该遵循的程序。目前在内布拉斯加州有一个未决案件，输油管道将经过那里，一名州法院法官对该计划提出了质疑。在我们知道路线之前，很难完成这项评估。我认为我们不应该简化这个程序。
I have also noted that, as policy matter, my government believes that we should judge this pipeline based on whether or not it accelerates climate change or whether it helps the American people with their energy costs and their gas prices. And I have to constantly push back against this idea that somehow the Keystone pipeline is either this massive jobs bill for the United States, or is somehow lowering gas prices. 我还指出，作为政策问题，我国政府认为我们应该根据这条管道是否会加速气候变化，或者是否有助于美国人民的能源成本和汽油价格来判断它。我必须不断反驳这样一种观点，即Keystone输油管道要么是美国的大规模就业法案，要么能降低汽油价格。
Understand what this project is. It is providing the ability of Canada to pump their oil, send it through our land, down to the Gulf, where it will be sold everywhere else. That doesn't have an impact on U.S. gas prices. You know what does have an impact on U.S. gas prices is the incredible boom in U.S. oil production and natural gas production that's taken place under my administration. 请理解这个项目是什么。它让加拿大能够开采他们的石油，通过我们的土地输送到墨西哥湾，然后销往其他地方。这对美国的汽油价格没有影响。你知道什么对美国汽油价格有影响吗？那就是在我政府领导下发生的美国石油和天然气生产的惊人繁荣。
And if my Republican friends really want to focus on what's good for the American people in terms of job creation and lower energy costs, we should be engaging in a conversation about what are we doing to produce even more homegrown energy. I'm happy to have that conversation. 如果我的共和党朋友们真的想关注什么对美国人民有利——创造就业和降低能源成本——我们应该进行一场对话，讨论我们正在做什么来生产更多的本土能源。我很乐意进行那场对话。
With respect to the climate change deal, I have been very clear that I have responsibilities as President not just to current generations, but to future generations. The science is indisputable. The planet is getting warm, and it is getting warmer in part because of man-made activity. 关于气候变化协议，我已经非常明确地表示，我作为总统的责任不仅是对当代人，也是对子孙后代。科学是无可辩驳的。地球正在变暖，部分原因是人类活动。
And the release of carbon gases -- carbon dioxide and greenhouse gases into the atmosphere can have a potentially devastating effect that will cost our country, could devastate communities, could increase the impact of natural disasters, and will have an impact worldwide that is destabilizing and could affect our national security. That's not my opinion, by the way, that is the opinion of our Joint Chiefs of Staff, that climate change is a direct national security threat. 碳排放——二氧化碳和温室气体排放到大气中，可能会产生破坏性影响，让我们国家付出代价，可能摧毁社区，可能增加自然灾害的影响，并将在全球范围内产生不稳定的影响，可能影响我们的国家安全。顺便说一句，这不是我的观点，这是我们参谋长联席会议的观点，他们认为气候变化是一个直接的国家安全威胁。
Now the argument that I've received in the past has been either denial of the science or, alternatively, there's no point in us doing something about it despite us being one of the two largest emitters in the world, because if we do something and China doesn't do anything, we'll just put ourselves at a competitive disadvantage, we'll lose jobs to China, and the problem won't be solved anyway. 现在我过去收到的论点要么是否认科学，要么是，尽管我们是世界上最大的两个排放国之一，但我们做些什么也没用，因为如果我们采取行动而中国不采取行动，我们只会让自己处于竞争劣势，我们会把工作机会输给中国，而且问题无论如何也解决不了。
I'm not going deny the science, but I took seriously the notion that we want all countries to participate in solving a global problem. And so I engaged with China over a lengthy set of negotiations. And by all independent accounts, for the first time, we got China to make a very serious commitment to constrain its greenhouse gases. Why would anybody be against that? That sounds like the right thing to do to me. So that's a response to those specific ideas. 我不会否认科学，但我认真对待这样一种观点，即我们希望所有国家都参与解决一个全球性问题。因此，我与中国进行了长时间的谈判。根据所有独立的说法，我们第一次让中国做出了非常严肃的承诺来限制其温室气体排放。为什么会有人反对呢？这在我听来是正确的事情。所以这是对那些具体观点的回应。
But let me reiterate what I said at the top. The fact that I disagree or Republicans disagree with me on a certain set of issues doesn't exclude us working together on a whole range of issues where we do agree. They're interested in tax reform -- so am I. Let's get to work. They're interested in promoting trade that will create jobs and opportunity for U.S. workers and U.S. businesses -- all over it. It's part of what this Asia trip has been all about. 但让我重申我一开始说的话。我和共和党人在某些问题上存在分歧，这并不排除我们在很多我们达成一致的问题上合作。他们对税收改革感兴趣——我也是。让我们开始工作吧。他们对促进贸易感兴趣，这将为美国工人和美国企业创造就业机会——我完全赞成。这就是这次亚洲之行的意义所在。
They're interested in rebuilding our roads, our bridges, our ports, our airports, putting people back to work, making sure we're competitive -- I'm game. So the one thing that I think is going to be important for us to have a successful partnership over the next couple of years is not making disagreements on a single issue suddenly a deal-breaker on every issue. 他们对重建我们的道路、桥梁、港口、机场感兴趣，让人们重返工作岗位，确保我们的竞争力——我很乐意。所以我认为，在未来几年里，我们要有一个成功的伙伴关系，重要的一点是，不要让在一个问题上的分歧突然成为所有问题的障碍。
Democracy can never work that way because there are always going to be some differences. And when there are differences you can't elevate those differences above the commonalities. 民主永远不能那样运作，因为总会有一些分歧。当有分歧时，你不能把分歧置于共识之上。
I'm sorry that was a long answer, but it was a lot of questions. 抱歉回答得太长了，但问题确实很多。
Do you want to -- 你想——
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: I'm sorry the President can't get away from all those. 昂山素季女士：很抱歉总统躲不开这些问题。
Barack Obama: I know. But before Daw Suu responds to the point about the constitutional amendment, I just want to emphasize, ultimately it's up to the people of Burma to make a decision about all these provisions. 巴拉克·奥巴马：我知道。但在素季女士回应宪法修改的问题之前，我想强调一点，归根结底，所有这些条款都要由缅甸人民来决定。
I expressed an objective view that some of current provisions don't seem to have much grounding in common sense or precedent when you look at other constitutions around the world, and seem more focused on advantaging or disadvantaging certain players. And one of the basic concepts of a constitution is that it creates a level playing field for all people, and then so I use that as an example not because I think my voice is the one that's most relevant in terms of the constitutional amendment process, but ultimately it's up to the people of Burma. 我表达了一个客观的观点，即当你看看世界上其他国家的宪法时，目前的一些条款似乎没有太多的常识或先例基础，而更多地是针对某些参与者的有利或不利。宪法的一个基本概念是它为所有人创造一个公平的竞争环境，所以我举这个例子不是因为我认为我的声音在宪法修改进程中是最重要的，归根结底这取决于缅甸人民。
Q: [Off-mic.] 问：（麦克风外）
Barack Obama: I did? It doesn't make much sense to me. 巴拉克·奥巴马：我说了吗？这对我来说说不通。
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: I believe democracy should stand up for that principle. 昂山素季女士：我认为民主应该捍卫那个原则。
Barack Obama: Absolutely. 巴拉克·奥巴马：当然。
Daw Aung San Suu Kyi: Well, I've always said that it's somewhat flattering to have a constitution written with me in mind. But it shouldn't be done that way. That's not how a democratic constitution should be written. And we object to that clause not because -- not because it debars me from the presidency as such, but because it is against the principle of democracy and also unconstitutional. The constitution says that all citizens should be treated as equals, and this is discrimination on the grounds of my children, my children's spouses, et cetera, et cetera. 昂山素季女士：嗯，我一直说，有一部为我量身定做的宪法，这多少有点让人受宠若惊。但不应该那样做。民主宪法不应该那样写。我们反对那条款不是因为——不是因为它剥夺了我的总统职位，而是因为它违反了民主原则，也是违宪的。宪法规定所有公民都应被平等对待，而这是基于我的子女、我子女的配偶等等等等的歧视。
Now, this is not acceptable. And our people are firmly behind us in our desire to change this clause. And if President Obama said anything about the necessity to change a clause like that, they will love him very much for it. So he will be very popular among our people. 这是不可接受的。我们人民坚决支持我们修改这一条款的愿望。如果奥巴马总统说了任何关于修改这样一个条款的必要性的话，他们会因此非常爱他的。所以他会在我们人民中非常受欢迎。
And as he said, in the end, it is up to our people to shape the destiny of our country, including the way the constitution is going to be rewritten. And I think the majority of our people understand that this constitution cannot stand as it is if we want to make the full transition to democracy; 59(f), as you know, debars anybody who is children of -- the spouses of the children belong to -- are citizens of another country. 正如他所说，归根结底，是我们的人民来塑造我们国家的命运，包括宪法将如何重写的方式。我认为我们大多数人民都明白，如果我们想要实现向民主的全面转型，这部宪法就不能保持原样；正如你所知，第59(f)条禁止任何子女的——子女的配偶属于——是另一个国家公民的人。
And according to the law -- and I think the President will know the law better than I do because I'm not a lawyer -- according to the law, anybody who is over the age of 18, or whatever legal adult age may be in his or her country, is responsible for himself or herself. Nobody else is responsible for that person. 根据法律——我想总统比我更懂法律，因为我不是律师——根据法律，任何超过18岁的人，或者无论其所在国家的法定成年年龄是多少，都要为自己负责。没有其他人要为那个人负责。
So from that point of view also, you cannot penalize anybody for what his or her adult children do. From that point of view, it's illegal, it's against all norms of justice. And from the point of view of democracy, it is not right to discriminate against one particular citizen. You wouldn't like to be discriminated against, would you? 所以从这个角度来看，你也不能因为任何人的成年子女做了什么而惩罚他/她。从这个角度来看，这是非法的，违反了所有正义准则。从民主的角度来看，歧视一个特定的公民是不对的。你不会喜欢被歧视的，对吧？
So I think our people support the idea of amending this clause because -- not particularly because they want me to be president, perhaps because they do. But I don't think it is so much because of that, but because they realize that this is unfair, unjust and undemocratic. 所以我认为我们的人民支持修改这一条款的想法，不是特别因为他们想让我当总统——也许他们确实想。但我认为更多的不是因为这个，而是因为他们意识到这是不公平的、不公正的、不民主的。
Q: Thank you. I am [inaudible] from 11 Media from Myanmar. And I wanted to ask the question to Mr. President. The question is, have you discussed about the [inaudible] situation in Myanmar [inaudible] president Thein Sein last night? Because more journalists than politicians have been arrested, particularly in [inaudible], under the present Thein Sein administration. And when you discuss about this, how did he respond to this discussion? Thank you. 问：谢谢。我是（听不清）来自缅甸11媒体。我想问总统先生一个问题。问题是，您昨晚与登盛总统讨论了缅甸（听不清）局势吗？因为在本届登盛政府领导下，被捕的记者比政治家还多，特别是在（听不清）地区。当您讨论这个问题时，他对这次讨论有何回应？谢谢。
Barack Obama: I didn't bring up specific cases with him. I brought up a basic principle that I stated earlier, which is that a free press is a foundation for any democracy. 巴拉克·奥巴马：我没有向他提起具体案件。我提出了我之前说过的一个基本原则，那就是新闻自由是任何民主的基础。
We rely on journalists to explain and describe the actions of our government. If the government controls the journalists, then it's very difficult for citizens to hold that government accountable. It's a fairly straightforward proposition. And I recognize that there is a transition process that's taking place, that there is a more robust debate today than there was the last time I visited. But to go back to what we said earlier, we can't be complacent. 我们依靠记者来解释和描述我们政府的行动。如果政府控制了记者，那么公民就很难让政府承担责任。这是一个相当直接的命题。我认识到正在发生一个转型过程，今天的辩论比我上次访问时更加活跃。但回到我们之前所说的，我们不能自满。
And we, as a government, are going to be troubled when we hear reports of journalists being imprisoned, being killed, being intimidated, or being censored. 作为一个政府，当我们听到记者被监禁、被杀害、受到恐吓或被审查的报道时，我们会感到不安。
And when we engage with this government -- or any government -- and we have evidence that that's taking place, then we're going to raise it. 当我们与这个政府——或任何政府——交往时，如果我们有证据表明这种情况正在发生，我们就会提出来。
Thank you very much. 非常感谢。