Moderator Evan Smith: Hi, Mr. President. 主持人埃文·史密斯：您好，总统先生。
President Obama: Hey! It's good to see you, and hello, Austin! I love Austin, Texas. 奥巴马总统：嘿！很高兴见到你，奥斯汀你们好！我爱得克萨斯州奥斯汀。
Audience Member: We love you! 观众：我们爱你！
President Obama: Thank you. It's just good to be back. 奥巴马总统：谢谢。能回来真好。
Moderator Smith: Nice to have you here. Welcome. Welcome to Austin. Welcome to South by Southwest. Let’s make a little news. You stopped at Torchy’s on the way in from the airport. 主持人史密斯：欢迎您的到来。欢迎来到奥斯汀，欢迎来到西南偏南大会。咱们爆个小料吧——您从机场来的路上顺路去了 Torchy's 塔可店。
President Obama: I did. 奥巴马总统：没错。
Moderator Smith: You did. Would you please share with the world what you told me backstage -- your order? Perfectly in keeping with your political views. 主持人史密斯：确实去了。能不能跟全世界分享一下您后台跟我说的——您点了什么？简直完美契合您的政治立场啊。
President Obama: I ordered the Democrat. But then I ordered a Republican and an Independent, because I wanted to give all people a proper hearing. I wanted to be fair. 奥巴马总统：我点了"民主党"口味。但还点了"共和党"和"独立党"口味，因为我想让所有人都得到公平的表达机会。我得公平嘛。
Moderator Smith: Bipartisan in tacos as in life. 主持人史密斯：塔可上两党通吃，做人也一样。
President Obama: That's exactly right. 奥巴马总统：完全正确。
Moderator Smith: That's how it goes. Mr. President, you're very nice to be here with us today. And you came for a purpose. You want to accomplish something. You said as much in your weekly radio address last weekend. I got the opportunity to hear it. Some people in the room have not heard it. For their benefit, and people outside the room, would you say why you're here? Make the pitch in miniature, please. 主持人史密斯：就是这个理。总统先生，非常感谢您今天到场。您来是有目的的，想做成一些事。您上周末的每周广播讲话里也提到了。我有幸听过了，但现场有些人还没听过。为了他们，也为了场外观众，您能说说为什么来这里吗？请简单介绍一下。
President Obama: Well, first of all, I'm here because I like excuses to come to Austin, Texas. And that's a good enough reason. And I want to acknowledge your Mayor, Steve Adler, who bought tacos with me. 奥巴马总统：嗯，首先，我来这儿是因为我喜欢找借口来得州奥斯汀。这个理由就足够充分了。我还要介绍你们的市长史蒂夫·阿德勒，他刚跟我一起吃了塔可。
I normally don't do this, but I'm going to embarrass somebody -- I'm going to also acknowledge the Chancellor of the Texas System because he’s one of my favorite people and a truly great American -- Bill McRaven, who I think is over there. It's pretty rare where a chancellor of a university system can really mess you up. So, in case any of the students are wondering, don't mess with your chancellor. But I knew him as Admiral, and he served America as well as anybody served it. 我通常不这么做，但今天要"曝光"一个人——我还要介绍得州大学系统的校监，他是我最敬佩的人之一，一位真正伟大的美国人——比尔·麦克雷文，我想他就在那边。能让你吃不了兜着走的大学系统校监，那可不多见。所以在座的学生们听好了，别惹你们的校监。但我认识他时他还是海军上将，他为美国效力的程度不输给任何人。
Look, we are at a moment in history where technology, globalization, our economy is changing so fast. And this gathering, South by Southwest, brings together people who are at the cutting-edge of those changes. Those changes offer us enormous opportunities but also are very disruptive and unsettling. They empower individuals to do things that they could have never dreamed of before, but they also empower folks who are very dangerous to spread dangerous messages. 听着，我们正处在一个历史时刻，技术、全球化、经济都在飞速变化。西南偏南这个盛会，把站在变革最前沿的人聚到了一起。这些变革带来了巨大机遇，但也极具颠覆性，让人不安。它们让个人有能力去做以前做梦都想不到的事，但也让非常危险的人有能力传播危险信息。
And part of my challenge since I've been President is trying to find ways in which our government can be a part of the positive change that's taking place and can help convene and catalyze folks in the private sector and the non-profit sector to be part of the broader civic community in tackling some of our biggest challenges. 我任总统以来的挑战之一，就是想办法让政府能够参与正在发生的积极变革，并且帮助召集和推动私营部门及非营利部门的人们，成为更广泛公民社会的一份子，共同应对一些重大挑战。
And just three things that I talked about during my weekly address where this group, I think, is prime to make a difference. Number one, we're spending a lot of time figuring out how can we make government work through technology, digital platforms, and so forth. So, for example, we've reduced the FAFSA form process where you apply for student aid by about two-thirds just by digitalizing it, putting it online, making it a little more common sense. We have made it now possible to apply for Social Security online in ways that couldn't be done before. 我在每周讲话中提到了三件事，我认为在座各位完全有能力在这三方面做出改变。第一，我们花了很多时间研究如何通过技术和数字平台让政府运转得更好。比如，我们把学生资助申请流程数字化、放到网上，就把办理时间缩短了约三分之二。现在社保也可以在线申请了，这在以前是做不到的。
Across agencies, we're interacting every day with our government, and the question is, how do we make that work better? Because an anti-government mentality grows if people feel frustrated because they’re not getting good service. 各个部门——我们每天都在和政府打交道，问题是如何让这种互动变得更好？因为如果人们得不到好服务而感到沮丧，反政府心态就会滋长。
The second thing that these new technologies allow us to do is to tackle big problems in new ways. We had a conference in Washington a few weeks back on what we're calling precision medicine -- the capacity today to potentially cure diseases because we understand the human genome and we understand that a cure for me may not be the same as a cure for you. And there’s incredible research taking place all around the country, but we haven't gathered all that data together to make sure that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. 第二，这些新技术让我们能用新方式解决重大问题。几周前我们在华盛顿开了个会，讨论所谓的"精准医疗"——也就是如今我们有可能治愈疾病的能力，因为我们了解了人类基因组，也明白对我有效的疗法对你可能不一样。全国各地都在进行令人惊叹的研究，但我们还没把所有数据汇集起来，确保整体大于部分之和。
And number three, we want to make sure that we're using big data, analytics, technology to make civic participation easier. Voters -- increasing voting rights and making sure that people are informed about who they’re voting for and why they’re voting. Making sure that community organizations or activists are able to meet and help to shape our society in new ways. 第三，我们要确保利用大数据、分析技术和科技让公民参与变得更容易。选民方面——扩大投票权，确保人们了解在投谁的票、为什么投票。确保社区组织或活动家能够以新方式交流，帮助塑造社会。
So the reason I'm here really is to recruit all of you. It's to say to you as I'm about to leave office, how can we start coming up with new platforms, new ideas, new approaches across disciplines and across skill sets to solve some of the big problems that we're facing today. 所以我来这儿的真正目的就是招募你们所有人。我想对你们说，在我即将卸任之际，我们如何开始提出新平台、新想法、新方法，跨越学科和技能组合，来解决今天面临的一些重大问题。
Because, I've said this before, I said this at the State of the Union, the most important office in a democracy is the office of citizen. And right now, with all the talent that's out there, our government is not working and our politics isn't working as well as it should -- the only way we're going to solve that is make sure that we're getting citizens involved in ways that we haven't up until now. 因为我以前就说过，国情咨文中也说过，民主制度中最重要的职位是公民的职位。而现在，有这么多人才存在，我们的政府却没有发挥应有的作用，我们的政治也没有发挥应有的作用——解决这个问题的唯一办法，就是确保让公民以从未有过的方式参与进来。
Moderator Smith: Mr. President, the theory of bringing tech more closely aligned with government in solving problems is great, but the reality is that the culture of the tech sector and the culture of government could not be more different. Government is big and bloated and slow and risk-averse, and it's run on outmoded systems and outmoded equipment. Tech is sleek and streamlined, and fail-fast and enamored of the new and the shiny. How do you take these two things that seem culturally to be so unalike and put them together in a way where they can and want to work together? 主持人史密斯：总统先生，让科技更紧密地与政府合作解决问题，这个理念很好，但现实是科技行业的文化和政府的文化截然不同。政府庞大、臃肿、缓慢、厌恶风险，运行在过时的系统和设备上。科技界则高效、精简、快速试错，迷恋新鲜事物。您怎么把这两个文化上天差地别的东西放到一起，让它们愿意并且能够合作？
President Obama: Well, let me give you an example of the big and the bloated and the frustrated. You may recall that I passed this law called the Affordable Care Act to sign people up for health care. And then the website didn’t work. 奥巴马总统：嗯，我来给你举个"庞大、臃肿、令人沮丧"的例子。你可能还记得，我通过了《平价医疗法案》，让人们注册医保。然后那个网站就崩了。
Moderator Smith: I heard that. 主持人史密斯：我听说了。
President Obama: And this was a little embarrassing for me because I was the cool, early adaptor President. 奥巴马总统：这对我来说有点尴尬，因为我本来是那个"很酷、早早用上新技术"的总统。
Moderator Smith: Right. Not exactly an advertisement for -- 主持人史密斯：是啊。这可不太像是——
President Obama: And my entire campaign had been premised on having really cool technology, and social media and all that. Well, here’s what happened, was that the procurement systems, the specifications, the way that software was built in government was adapted for the age when procurement was for buying boots or buying pencils or buying furniture as opposed to buying software. 奥巴马总统：我整个竞选活动都是以酷炫的技术和社交媒体之类为基础的。是这么回事——政府的采购系统、规格要求、软件开发方式，还停留在采购靴子、铅笔或家具的年代，完全不适用于采购软件。
And so there’s an example of an outdated system -- bloated, risk-averse, not working well. Here’s what happened as a consequence of healthcare.gov breaking down, though -- we had to bring in a SWAT team of all my friends from Silicon Valley and from Austin and some of the best software engineers in the world to come in and fix it -- which we did in about three, four months’ time. 所以这就是一个过时系统的例子——臃肿、规避风险、运转不畅。不过，医保网站崩溃之后发生的事情是——我们不得不请来一支"特警队"，都是我从硅谷和奥斯汀找来的朋友，还有世界上最顶尖的一些软件工程师，来修复这个网站——我们用了大约三四个月就搞定了。
And what we realized was that we could potentially build a SWAT team, a world-class technology office inside of the government that was helping across agencies. We've dubbed that the U.S. Digital Services. And we've got some of the top talent from Google, from Facebook, from all the top tech companies. 然后我们意识到，可以在政府内部组建一支特警队，一个世界级的技术办公室，跨部门提供帮助。我们把它命名为"美国数字服务局"。我们从谷歌、Facebook以及所有顶尖科技公司招募了最优秀的人才。
These folks are coming in, in some cases, for six months, in some cases for two years -- and they are making an enormous difference in making sure that veterans are getting services on time, fixing outdated systems, making sure that agencies like the Small Business Administration that has been clunky, is redesigning itself so that if an entrepreneur wants to start up a business here in Texas, that they can go to one spot and within a day they’ve handled all the regulatory red tape that used to require them maybe months to navigate. 这些人来这里工作，有的六个月，有的两年——他们产生了巨大的影响：确保退伍军人按时获得服务，修复过时的系统，确保像小企业管理局这种一直很笨重的机构进行自我重塑，这样如果有企业家想在得州创业，他们只需要去一个地方，一天之内就能办完所有审批手续，而以前可能需要好几个月才能搞定。
Now, the folks who are working in this Digital Service, they’re having a great time, and in part because they are harnessing incredible skills to a purpose where they know that millions of people can be helped. And what they’ll tell me is that as long as they feel that they’ve got a President and somebody who’s providing some air cover, there’s no system that they can’t get in there and work and change and make it significantly better. 现在，在数字服务局工作的这些人干得很开心，部分原因是他们把出色的技能用在了知道能帮助数百万人的事业上。他们会跟我说，只要他们觉得有总统和其他人在给他们"遮风挡雨"，就没有什么系统是他们介入后无法改进、无法让它变得更好的。
So part of my job is to try to institutionalize that over the next several years. And I want to make sure that the next President and the federal government from here on out is in constant improvement mode and we’re constantly bringing in new talent and new ideas to solve some of these big problems. It can be done. It requires some effort, but everything requires some effort. 所以我的一部分工作就是在接下来几年里把这种机制制度化。我要确保下一任总统以及联邦政府从现在起处于持续改进的状态，不断引进新人才和新想法来解决这些重大问题。这是可以做到的。需要付出一些努力，但什么事不需要努力呢。
Moderator Smith: Because, Mr. President, you know, I talked to tech people in advance of your coming, and I said, if you were asked by the President or by the administration to come in and work with them, what would the conditions need to be that would make it possible? And they said, well, we would need some kind of a carve-out, some kind of flexibility from rules and regulations. We would be willing to work with the government, and maybe we would then donate back the IP to the public sector. 主持人史密斯：因为，总统先生，您来之前我跟一些科技界人士聊过，我问他们，如果总统或政府邀请你们来合作，需要什么条件才能实现？他们说，我们需要某种特殊政策，在规章制度上有一定的灵活性。我们愿意和政府合作，而且可能会把知识产权捐回公共部门。
Moderator Smith: Or if we want to give some of the employees from our payroll the opportunity to work in government, maybe we could get -- as you would with another kind of donation -- some sort of a tax break back. We’d be willing to work, but the government would have to come at least a little bit in our direction. You’re saying you’re willing to do that? 主持人史密斯：或者，如果我们想让自己公司的员工有机会去政府工作，也许我们能得到——就像其他类型的捐赠一样——某种税收减免。我们愿意合作，但政府至少得往我们这边靠一点吧。您是说您愿意这么做？
President Obama: Well, I’m not saying I’m willing to do it; I’m saying we’re doing it. 奥巴马总统：嗯，我不是说我愿意这么做；我是说我们已经在这么做了。
Moderator Smith: You’re doing it now -- yes, sir. 主持人史密斯：你们现在就在做——好的，先生。
President Obama: It is currently happening. And the opportunities are there. But I want to focus on the fact that there are different ways for people here to get engaged. It’s not just you coming in -- although we want to create a pipeline where there’s a continuous flow of talent that is helping to shape the government. The other thing that we’re doing, though, is we’re also convening people to solve problems, and they may in their existing roles be able to work together to make a huge difference. 奥巴马总统：这事目前正在进行中。机会是有的。但我想强调的是，在座的人有不同的参与方式。不只是你们来政府工作——尽管我们想建立一个渠道，让人才持续流入，帮助塑造政府。不过，我们还在做的另一件事是，把人们召集起来解决问题，他们在现有岗位上就可以携手合作，产生巨大影响。
I’ll give you a specific example. Before I came in here, I met with an incredible group of people -- entrepreneurs, moviemakers, organizations, tech leaders -- to talk about how we make a real difference on countering violent extremism. It's not enough if we're going to defeat ISIL just to take out their leadership or to control certain territories, if, in the virtual world, they are consistently reaching kids here in the United States or elsewhere in the world and recruiting them and twisting their minds to do terrible things. We've got to be able to penetrate that. 我给你举个具体的例子。在我上台之前，我会见了一群非常了不起的人——企业家、电影制作人、各种机构、科技领袖——讨论如何在打击暴力极端主义方面真正有所作为。如果我们要击败 ISIL，仅仅除掉他们的领导人或控制某些地区是不够的，如果在虚拟世界里，他们还在不断接触美国或世界各地的年轻人，招募他们，扭曲他们的思想去做可怕的事情。我们必须能够打入那个空间。
For good reasons, we don't want the government to be the lead on that. First of all, we're not credible with the people who might be receiving those messages. Second of all, it's dangerous if the government gets in the business of propaganda. So what I said to them was we'll help convene and put you guys in a room together. Where there are resources that are necessary, we can help provide it. But, essentially, you figure out how we can reach young people who might be vulnerable to extremist messages. 出于充分的理由，我们不希望政府在这件事上打头阵。首先，对于可能收到这些信息的人来说，我们没有可信度。其次，如果政府做起了宣传的生意，那是很危险的。所以我对他们说，我们会帮忙召集，把你们凑到一块儿。需要资源的话，我们可以帮忙提供。但本质上，你们来想办法，看看怎样才能接触到那些可能受到极端主义信息影响的年轻人。
You tell us, based on the analytics and the data and the algorithms that you're working with on a day-to-day basis to sell products, what is it that's going to really penetrate here. How can we amplify powerful stories that are already taking place so that there are platforms that can reach as many people as possible? 你们告诉我们，基于你们每天用来销售产品的分析方法、数据和算法，到底什么才能真正触达人心。我们怎样才能放大那些已经在发生的有力故事，让平台能够触达尽可能多的人？
Moderator Smith: So whether you solve the problem or they solve the problem, it’s all good? 主持人史密斯：所以不管是您解决问题还是他们解决问题，都可以？
President Obama: Exactly. I’ve give you a second example, and that is the issue of voting -- I mentioned this earlier. We’re the only advanced democracy in the world that makes it harder for people to vote. No, I hear laughing, but it’s sad. We take enormous pride in the fact that we are the world’s oldest continuous democracy, and yet we systematically put up barriers and make it as hard as possible for our citizens to vote. 奥巴马总统：没错。我再给你举第二个例子，就是投票的问题——我之前提到过。我们是世界上唯一一个让投票变得更难的先进民主国家。我听到有人笑，但这很可悲。我们无比自豪于自己是世界上历史最悠久的持续民主国家，但我们却系统性地设置障碍，让公民尽可能难以投票。
President Obama: And it is much easier to order pizza or a trip than it is for you to exercise the single most important task in a democracy, and that is for you to select who is going to represent you in government. 奥巴马总统：点个披萨、订个旅行都比你行使民主制度中最重要的那项权利要容易得多，那就是选出谁来在政府中代表你。
Now, I think it’s important for a group like this, as we come up to an election, regardless of your party affiliation, to think about how do we redesign our systems so that we don’t have 50 percent or 55 percent voter participation on presidential elections, and during off-year congressional elections, you’ve got 39 or 40 percent voting. 我认为，对于在座这样的群体来说，随着选举的临近，无论你属于哪个党派，都应该思考我们如何重新设计制度，这样总统选举的投票率就不会只有 50% 或 55%，而非大选年的国会选举投票率只有 39% 或 40%。
Moderator Smith: Mr. President, you’re in the state with the worst voter turnout in the country over the last few years. 主持人史密斯：总统先生，您所在的这个州过去几年的投票率是全国最低的。
President Obama: By coincidence. 奥巴马总统：纯属巧合。
Moderator Smith: We would take 55 percent tomorrow if we could get it. 主持人史密斯：我们要是能有 55% 的投票率，明天就谢天谢地了。
President Obama: There is a reason I’m bringing this up. But it’s not just Texas. And so one of the things that we’re doing is engaging folks who are already doing interesting work in the online space, how can we create safe, secure, smart systems for people to be able to vote much easier online, and what are the technologies to help people get aware of what they’re voting about, who they’re voting for -- that’s, again, an issue where you don’t want the federal government engineering all that. 奥巴马总统：我提这个是有原因的。但不只是得州。所以我们正在做的一件事就是，联系那些已经在网络领域做出有意思工作的人，探讨如何创建安全、可靠、智能的系统，让人们能够更便捷地在线投票，以及用什么技术帮助人们了解他们在投票选什么、选谁——这又是一个你不会想让联邦政府全权设计的问题。
President Obama: But what we can do is to have the incredible talent that’s represented in this auditorium really spend time thinking about that and getting to work on it. 奥巴马总统：但我们能做的是，让这个礼堂里在座的杰出人才真正花时间思考这个问题，并且动手去做。
Moderator Smith: But governments, Mr. President, governments need to play a role in it. They have to pass legislation that enables some of these things. 主持人史密斯：但是政府，总统先生，政府需要在其中发挥作用。政府得通过立法才能实现其中一些事情。
President Obama: Yes. 奥巴马总统：没错。
Moderator Smith: So in Texas, again, a state with terrible voter turnout every time, we broke records on primary day but we still had the second worst voting age participation of any state that’s voted so far. We can’t get out of our own way. You need, in Texas, legislation that enables this. 主持人史密斯：所以在得州，又是这个每次投票率都惨不忍睹的州，我们初选中打破了纪录，但在所有已经投票的州中，适龄选民投票率仍然是倒数第二。我们就是自己跟自己过不去。得州需要立法来实现这些。
Moderator Smith: We won’t even allow people to register to vote -- register to vote, not vote -- register online in Texas -- register online. We can pay our taxes, we can hold our phone up at the supermarket to pay with our credit card, but somehow online voter registration is perceived to be insecure, or same-day registration. 主持人史密斯：我们甚至不让人们在线登记投票——是登记投票，不是投票——得州连在线登记都不行。我们能在线缴税，能在超市刷手机用信用卡付款，但不知怎么的，在线选民登记就被认为不安全，同日登记也不行。
President Obama: It’s not insecure. It’s done because the folks who are currently governing the good state of Texas -- aren’t interested in having more people participate. 奥巴马总统：这不安全？才不是。这么做是因为目前治理得克萨斯这个好州的人——对让更多人参与投票不感兴趣。
So obviously you’ve got to make a political argument about why this is important, and not every state is going to move along the same direction. 所以显然你得从政治角度论证为什么这很重要，而且不是每个州都会朝同一个方向前进。
But I will tell you that if we can create more and more models that show that if made easier, more people vote, and that it is seamless and that it is secure, and jurisdictions that are willing to adopt and support these new mechanisms are in place, and if we are building more models of civic engagement and using the tools and technology that we’re using to buy things to participate in self-governance, then over time -- look, Texas is never going to be an early adapter of what I’m talking about here. 但我可以告诉你，如果我们能建立越来越多的示范，证明如果投票更便捷，参与的人就会更多，而且整个过程顺畅又安全，那些愿意采纳和支持这些新机制的司法管辖区也已经到位，如果我们建立更多公民参与的模式，用买东西的那些工具和技术来参与自治，那么随着时间的推移——听着，得州永远不会是我所说这些事情的早期采用者。
But over time, pressure builds for us to create systems that make government more responsive and make it work better. 但久而久之，压力会累积，迫使我们建立让政府更回应民意、运转更好的制度。
Moderator Smith: Let me stay with Texas and touch on something you alluded to earlier -- that there are a lot of people in the world today who don’t like government, don’t trust government, don’t think government can do good. You are in Texas, the hating-on-government capital of the Western world, right? We hate government so much we’d rather have no government, except we then wouldn’t have anybody to sue. So we need government for at least one reason. How do you change the perception that government can do good at a moment when people have decided government can’t do good? 主持人史密斯：让我们接着聊得州，再谈谈您之前提到的一点——如今世界上有很多人不喜欢政府、不信任政府、不认为政府能做好事。您现在就在得州，这里可是西方世界"仇恨政府"的大本营，对吧？我们太恨政府了，宁愿没有政府，只可惜那样就没人可以告了。所以至少为了一个理由我们也需要政府。在人们已经认定政府做不了好事的时候，您怎么改变这种看法？
President Obama: Well, part of it is the fact that when government does great things, we take it for granted and it’s not a story. I mean, every day, government is delivering for everybody in this room, whether you know it or not. I can find the fiercest libertarian in the room who despises every level of government, thinks it’s all corrupt, but they’re checking the weather on their phone, and lo and behold, it turns out that there’s a government satellite out there that is facilitating that. 奥巴马总统：嗯，部分原因在于，当政府做了了不起的事情时，我们觉得理所当然，这也成不了新闻。我的意思是，政府每天都在为在座的每个人服务，不管你知不知道。我能在这房间里找到最激进的自由意志主义者，他痛恨各级政府，认为全都腐败不堪，但他正在手机上查看天气，结果呢，没想到吧，居然有一颗政府卫星在为此提供支持。
Moderator Smith: That’s government. 主持人史密斯：那是政府。
President Obama: And they’d be really irritated if they couldn’t figure out whether it was going to be 70 and sunny or 60 and rainy tomorrow. But that’s not reported as government. We just take for granted, of course, there are roads, and, of course, there’s a geo-satellite system and, of course, we have Special Forces who are making sure that folks aren’t blowing up our buildings. Well, part of our task is to tell a better story about what government does. 奥巴马总统：要是他搞不清楚明天是 70 度晴天还是 60 度雨天，他肯定会非常恼火。但这不会被报道成政府的功劳。我们只是理所当然地认为，当然有路啊，当然有卫星定位系统啊，当然有特种部队确保没人炸我们的大楼啊。我们的部分任务就是更好地讲述政府做了什么。
Now, government is often its own worst enemy in the sense that it has to also be more responsive where people interact in a direct way with government. I’ve said before that I could change the politics of America faster than just about anything if I could just take control of all the DMVs in the country. Because if somebody goes to get their license renewed and it takes them two hours -- 现在，政府常常是自己最大的敌人，因为在人们直接和政府打交道的地方，政府也必须变得更有回应性。我以前就说过，如果我能掌控全国所有的车管所，我就能比什么都更快地改变美国的政治。因为如果有人去换驾照花了两个小时——
Moderator Smith: And they walk away frustrated. 主持人史密斯：然后一肚子火地离开。
President Obama: -- and everybody is kind of surly -- 奥巴马总统：——每个人都有点没好气——
Moderator Smith: Right. 主持人史密斯：对。
President Obama: -- that’s their impression of government. 奥巴马总统：——那就是他们对政府的印象。
Moderator Smith: Yeah. 主持人史密斯：是啊。
President Obama: Or if their primary interaction with government is the IRS, you just don’t have a good association with government when you’re writing that check. But if we make it easier, if it’s being done online, if suddenly, you have the capacity to interact with government in a way that also gives you some feedback about how you’re tax dollars are being spent or why this is important, or what you’re doing, so that it’s a two-way exchange as opposed to something that feels distant and that you have no control over, then people’s attitudes change. 奥巴马总统：或者，如果他们和政府的主要交集是国税局，那你写支票的时候对政府肯定没什么好印象。但如果我们让事情变得更便捷，如果都能在线办理，如果突然间你能够以一种方式与政府互动，还能得到一些反馈，知道你的税花在了哪里、为什么这很重要、你在做什么，这样就成了双向交流，而不是那种感觉遥远、你完全无法掌控的东西，那么人们的态度就会改变。
Now, here’s the problem, and this is why politics matter. If there are those who despise government -- oftentimes because the absence of government allows them to pollute, or keep as much money as they can, or not have to answer to consumers who are complaining about their practices -- if they are controlling those who are currently in government and government gets starved of resources, then it can be a self-reinforcing notion that, in fact, government doesn’t work because it’s being starved. 现在，问题来了，这就是政治之所以重要的原因。如果那些痛恨政府的人——很多时候是因为没有政府他们就能污染环境、就能尽量多赚钱、就不用回应投诉他们的消费者——如果他们控制着目前执政的人，而政府又被剥夺了资源，那就会形成一种自我强化的观念：政府确实没用，因为它被饿死了。
A great example of this, by the way, I met with financial regulators this week to just get a report back on how we’re doing on Wall Street reform. One of the things that the left and the right agree on is that after the financial crisis, nothing changed, and all those folks on Wall Street who had done these terrible things just got away with it, and we didn’t change the system and it’s just the way it is now. Well, the truth of the matter is, actually, a lot changed. 顺便说一个很好的例子，这周我会见了金融监管者，听取华尔街改革进展的汇报。左派和右派对一件事是有共识的，那就是金融危机之后什么都没变，华尔街那些干了坏事的人全都逍遥法外，我们根本没改变体制，现在还是老样子。但事实是，实际上改变了很多。
The banks have been forced to capitalize much more. Some of the shoddy practices have been shut down. We set up a Consumer Finance Protection Bureau that prevents some of the mortgage practices -- that had ended up not only hurting individuals but also destabilizing the entire system. Derivatives now have to be set up on a clearinghouse platform that allows oversight in a way that didn’t exist before. 银行被迫大幅提高了资本金。一些劣质操作已经被叫停。我们成立了消费者金融保护局，制止了一些抵押贷款操作——那些操作最终不仅伤害了个人，还动摇了整个体系。衍生品现在必须在清算所平台上进行，这样就能接受监管，以前是做不到的。
The financial system is much more stable than it used to be. And too big to fail actually is much less likely, because if somebody engages in reckless practices we can now unwind them without them bringing down the entire system. 金融体系比以前稳定多了。"大而不倒"的问题实际上也大大缓解了，因为如果有人从事鲁莽操作，我们现在可以有序清算他们，而不会拖垮整个体系。
Moderator Smith: So how come we don’t know it then? 主持人史密斯：那我们怎么不知道呢？
President Obama: Well, first of all, that’s not a story that is interesting to people. What’s more interesting is a cynical view that terrible things happened and nothing got changed. And that’s how it gets reported both in popular culture as well as in the media. 奥巴马总统：嗯，首先，这种事对人们来说没什么意思。更有意思的是那种愤世嫉俗的观点：糟心事发生了，什么也没改变。流行文化和媒体都是这么报道的。
But the second thing that’s happened is, where it’s not -- where we still have work to do in this space -- the main reason we have work to do in this space is because this Congress has prevented oversight agencies like the FCC and the CFTC from having enough staff and resources to be able to enforce as well as they could some of the laws and the rules that are put in place. 但第二件事是，在这方面——在这方面我们还有工作要做——我们还有工作要做的主要原因是，这届国会阻止了 FCC 和 CFTC 等监管机构获得足够的人员和资源，无法尽可能有力地执行已经制定的一些法律法规。
And so we go back to the need for civic engagement. We cannot solve the problems in government and we cannot solve the problems that we face collectively as a society unless we, the people, are paying attention. And in an age in which people are getting information through digital platforms, through the Internet, where people’s attention spans have shrunk, it is critical that all of you who are shaping this environment are spending time thinking about how are we getting people -- how are we getting citizens engaged, and you, yourselves have to be engaged and spend some time thinking about it. 所以我们又回到了公民参与的必要性上。我们无法解决政府的问题，也无法解决我们作为一个社会共同面临的问题，除非我们——人民——在关注。在这个人们通过数字平台、通过互联网获取信息的时代，人们的注意力持续时间缩短了，至关重要的是，你们所有正在塑造这个环境的人，都要花时间思考如何让人们——如何让公民参与进来，你们自己也必须参与进来，花点时间思考这个问题。
It doesn’t mean you have to do it full-time. It doesn’t mean that you have to run for office yourself. But it does mean that whatever your field is, there is a way right now for you to engage and participate to take this democracy back in ways that we have not seen in a very long time. 这并不意味着你得全职做这件事。也不意味着你必须自己竞选公职。但它确实意味着，无论你的领域是什么，现在都有办法让你参与进来，以我们很久以来从未见过的方式夺回这个民主。
Moderator Smith: What you’re preaching, Mr. President, again -- nobody will take issue with the idea of more civic engagement in a digital age. But the question is whether everybody, all of us in this country, are in the same digital age, right? 主持人史密斯：总统先生，您所倡导的——数字时代更多公民参与，没人会对这个理念有异议。但问题是，是不是这个国家的每个人，我们所有人，都处在同一个数字时代？
You’re in a state that is seeing rapid changes in its population. We’ll soon be Hispanic majority. Well, in this state, as in a lot of other states, the digital divide -- access to Wi-Fi, access to devices continues to be an enormous problem. Fifty percent of adults in Hispanic households have no access to Internet at home. Fifty-four percent of African Americans have access, but 46 percent do not. Many more white households have access to the Internet than do non-white households. We know that we have this massive digital divide in this country, in Texas and elsewhere. 您所在的这个州人口正在快速变化。我们很快就会成为拉美裔占多数的州。而在这个州，就像在其他很多州一样，数字鸿沟——Wi-Fi 接入、设备获取——仍然是一个巨大的问题。拉美裔家庭中 50% 的成年人家里没有互联网。非洲裔美国人中有 54% 能上网，但还有 46% 不能。白人家庭的互联网接入率比非白人家庭高得多。我们知道这个国家存在巨大的数字鸿沟，在得州和其他地方都是如此。
Shouldn’t the government, before we start providing all the civic engagement through the digital space, make sure that everybody is in the digital space first? 政府难道不应该在我们通过数字空间提供所有公民参与途径之前，先确保每个人都能进入数字空间吗？
President Obama: Which is, actually, exactly what we’ve been trying to do over the last several years. When we passed the Recovery Act -- the stimulus that was very controversial at the time and that continues to be criticized by the other party, despite the fact that unemployment is now below 5 percent -- and we avoided a Great Depression. Thanks, Obama. But embedded in that was a massive investment in making sure that communities that had been left out of broadband and Wi-Fi were reached. 奥巴马总统：其实，这正是我们过去几年一直在努力做的事情。我们通过《复苏法案》的时候——那个当时非常有争议、至今仍被对方政党批评的刺激计划，尽管现在失业率已经降到了 5% 以下——我们避免了大萧条。谢谢奥巴马。但其中包含了一项巨大的投资，就是确保那些被宽带和 Wi-Fi 遗忘的社区能够被覆盖到。
President Obama: And we have made enormous progress in extending more and more Internet access -- high-speed Internet access to communities all across the country. 奥巴马总统：我们在扩展互联网接入方面取得了巨大进展——高速互联网接入覆盖了全国各地更多的社区。
A second example -- we set up something called ConnectED, where our goal -- and we’re on track to meet this by 2018 -- is that 99 percent of classrooms have access to high-speed wireless. And the way we’ve done that, in part, is through federal spending, but what we’ve also done is we’ve partnered with an array of companies. 第二个例子——我们设立了"连接教育"项目，我们的目标——而且我们有望在 2018 年前实现——是让 99% 的教室都能用上高速无线网络。我们实现这个目标的方式，部分是通过联邦支出，但我们也做了一件事，就是与众多企业合作。
Moderator Smith: Right, private industries. 主持人史密斯：对，私营企业。
President Obama: Private industry has really stepped up. And so part of the task -- you’re right that we’ve got to make sure that, given the power of this space, everybody is plugged in. But one of the great tricks to all this is making sure that whatever government is doing is then supplemented with and enhanced by a private sector and nonprofit sector that are ready to step up. And it’s not just, by the way, getting a line in or Wi-Fi there. It’s also training teachers. We’ve set up something called -- well, open book? Somebody out here -- 奥巴马总统：私营企业确实站了出来。所以部分任务——你说得对，考虑到这个领域的力量，必须确保每个人都能接入。但这一切的一个诀窍就是，确保政府所做的一切，都能得到愿意站出来的私营部门和非营利部门的补充和加强。而且顺便说一句，这不只是拉根网线或装个 Wi-Fi 那么简单。还要培训教师。我们设立了一个叫做——嗯，"打开书本"？有人知道吗——
Audience Member: Open eBooks. 观众：开放电子书（Open eBooks）。
President Obama: There you go, Open eBooks. I knew there was somebody in the audience who’d know about this. To make sure that kids in places that don’t have a lot of books that suddenly they have access to this enormous e-library, and that that becomes folded into the mechanics and the infrastructure that’s been set in place. 奥巴马总统：对了，开放电子书。我就知道观众里有人知道这个。为了确保那些没什么书的地方的孩子，突然间能接触到这个巨大的电子图书馆，并且这能融入已经建立起来的机制和基础设施中。
Moderator Smith: Mr. President, very good, it’s important to have wired classrooms, but part of the problem is that 70 percent of homework assignments by one measure, given by teachers, require some Internet access. So it’s one thing to wire classrooms; the problem is homes. 主持人史密斯：总统先生，非常好，教室联网很重要，但部分问题在于，有一项统计显示，70% 的老师布置的作业都需要互联网接入。所以教室联网是一回事，问题在家里。
There was a story in The New York Times about a month ago that had a couple of kids from McAllen, a brother and sister, standing outside their school building into the wee hours of the night having to do their homework on their phones, using the Wi-Fi from the school after hours because they had no Wi-Fi at home. This is 2016. It just seems crazy. 大约一个月前《纽约时报》有篇报道，麦卡伦市的两个孩子，一对兄妹，深夜还站在教学楼外面，用手机蹭学校的 Wi-Fi 做作业，因为他们家里没有 Wi-Fi。现在可是 2016 年啊。这也太荒唐了。
President Obama: Which is why we’ve set up something called Opportunity Networks that is going to go into public housing, rural communities, low-income communities to make sure that access is available precisely so those young people can do the work. 奥巴马总统：所以我们设立了一个叫做"机会网络"的项目，要进入公共住房、农村社区、低收入社区，确保这些地方能接入网络，正是为了让那些年轻人能完成学业。
Moderator Smith: You’re going to try to solve this problem? 主持人史密斯：您打算解决这个问题？
President Obama: I am trying to solve every problem. But here -- 奥巴马总统：我打算解决所有问题。但是——
Moderator Smith: You’ve got to have a goal, I understand. 主持人史密斯：总得有个目标嘛，我懂。
President Obama: But here’s the point that I want to make. These are solvable problems, but it’s not a matter of us passively waiting for somebody else to solve it. And that’s part of the mindset that I’m trying to break. I tried to break it back in 2007, 2008, when I ran for this office. As you will recall, the slogan was not “Yes, I can” -- it was “Yes, We Can.” 奥巴马总统：但我想说的重点是。这些都是可以解决的问题，但不能被动地等着别人来解决。这就是我试图打破的一种心态。我早在 2007、2008 年竞选总统的时候就试图打破它了。你们应该记得，我的竞选口号不是"是的，我能"——而是"是的，我们能"。
President Obama: And we could sit here and you could list out an array of problems, inequities that have to be addressed. What I’m saying is, number one, government actually works better in so many areas than we give it credit for because we tend to focus on those areas where it’s not working as well. 奥巴马总统：我们可以坐在这里，列出一大堆问题、一大堆需要解决的不平等现象。我想说的是，第一，政府在很多领域其实比我们认为的做得更好，因为我们倾向于关注那些做得不好的领域。
Number two, part of the reason that government doesn’t always appear to provide a satisfactory solution is because government has to take on the hardest problems. The private sector doesn’t have to figure out how to educate the poorest kids. The private sector doesn’t have to figure out how to protect us from a terrorist cell. If you have aging, sick veterans, the private sector may not serve them as well, or to figure out how do we get homeless off the streets. 第二，政府之所以不总能给出令人满意的解决方案，部分原因是政府必须承担最困难的问题。私营部门不需要去想怎么教育最贫困的孩子。私营部门不需要去想怎么保护我们免受恐怖组织的袭击。如果你有年老多病的退伍军人，私营部门可能不会好好照顾他们，也不会去想怎么让流浪汉回归社会。
So the toughest problems are government problems. And finding solutions to those things can take time. And so you’re never going to get 100 percent satisfaction the way you might get that perfect cup of coffee, the perfect latte, or the perfect -- the lowest price on your ticket to Cancun -- because these are harder problems. 所以最棘手的问题都是政府的问题。为这些问题找到解决方案需要时间。所以你永远不可能得到 100% 的满足感，不像你买到一杯完美的咖啡、完美的拿铁，或者——买到去坎昆最便宜的机票——因为这些都是更难的问题。
But the third point that I’m trying to make here is that if we can reconceive of our government so that the interactions and the interplay between private sector, nonprofits, and government are opened up, and we use technology, data, social media in order to join forces around problems, then there’s no problem that we face in this country that is not soluble. And the key is to have incredible talent, as is gathered here, to focus on it. 但我想说的第三点是，如果我们能够重新构想政府，让私营部门、非营利组织和政府之间的互动与合作更加开放，利用技术、数据、社交媒体来围绕问题联合发力，那么我们国家面临的问题就没有一个是解决不了的。关键是要有像在座这样的杰出人才专注于此。
It’s not enough just to focus on what’s the cool next thing. Part of what we have to do is to figure out how do we use and harness the cool next thing to make sure that everybody in this country has opportunity. And to make sure that we’re dealing with our environment in an effective way. 只关注下一个酷炫的东西是不够的。我们必须做的一部分是，想清楚如何利用和驾驭下一个酷炫的东西，来确保这个国家的每个人都有机会。并确保我们能有效应对环境问题。
Moderator Smith: I want to use and harness the time we have. We’ve got 10 minutes left. We started a little late. 主持人史密斯：我想好好利用我们剩下的时间。我们还有 10 分钟。开始得晚了一点。
President Obama: Nice segue. That was good. 奥巴马总统：转场不错啊。挺好的。
Moderator Smith: Thank you. I appreciate it. Took the baton here, Mr. President. I took the baton. 主持人史密斯：谢谢。承让了，总统先生。接棒了。
President Obama: It was good. It was good. 奥巴马总统：不错。真的不错。
Moderator Smith: We asked for questions from regular folks through the Texas Tribune website. We’ve got a few of those. And I want to ask you about a couple of those. Some are related to the topics we’ve been talking about, and some are not. I’m going to go quickly so that we use the time we have. 主持人史密斯：我们通过《得克萨斯论坛报》网站征集了普通民众的问题。有一些问题。我想问您其中几个。有些和我们一直在聊的话题相关，有些不相关。我尽量快问快答，用好剩下的时间。
A bunch of people wanted me to ask you about Apple and the situation with Apple and the FBI. You’re trying to persuade the tech community that they should work with government. But it looks to the tech community -- at least some in the tech community -- that government is the enemy of the tech community in the way that it’s dealing with Apple. Some in the tech community. 很多人想让我问您关于苹果公司的事，就是苹果和 FBI 的那档子事。您在努力说服科技界应该和政府合作。但在科技界看来——至少科技界的一些人看来——政府在处理苹果这件事的方式上，就是科技界的敌人。只是一部分人。
The question I want to ask you is, putting aside the specifics of this specific case, the legal fight between the company and the FBI, there are big questions around the idea of how you balance the need for law enforcement to conduct investigations and the needs of citizens to protect their privacy. This is the old privacy versus security debate. Mr. President, where do you come down on the privacy versus security debate? 我想问您的是，撇开这个具体案件的细节，撇开公司和 FBI 之间的法律纠纷，关于如何平衡执法部门开展调查的需要和公民保护隐私的需要，有很多大问题。这就是那个古老的隐私与安全之争。总统先生，您在隐私与安全的辩论中站在哪一边？
President Obama: Well, first of all, I can’t comment on the specific case. So let’s set that aside. 奥巴马总统：嗯，首先，我不能对具体案件发表评论。所以我们先把那个放一边。
All of us value our privacy, and this is a society that is built on a Constitution and a Bill of Rights and a healthy skepticism about overreaching government power. 我们所有人都珍视隐私，这个社会是建立在宪法、权利法案以及对政府权力过度扩张的健康怀疑之上的。
Before smartphones were invented, and to this day, if there is probable cause to think that you have abducted a child, or that you are engaging in a terrorist plot, or you are guilty of some serious crime, law enforcement can appear before your -- at your doorstep and say, we have a warrant to search your home, and they can go into your bedroom and into your bedroom doors and rifle through your underwear to see if there’s any evidence of wrongdoing. 在智能手机发明之前，直到今天，如果有合理理由认为你绑架了一个孩子，或者你在策划恐怖袭击，或者你犯了某种严重罪行，执法部门可以出现在你家门口，说，我们有搜查令要搜查你家，然后他们可以走进你的卧室，打开你的衣橱，翻你的内衣抽屉，寻找任何不法行为的证据。
And we agree on that, because we recognize that just like all of our other rights -- freedom of speech, freedom of religion, et cetera -- that there are going to be some constraints that we impose in order to make sure that we are safe, secure and living in a civilized society. 这一点我们是同意的，因为我们认识到，就像我们所有其他权利一样——言论自由、宗教自由等等——为了确保我们安全、安稳、生活在文明社会中，我们要施加一些限制。
Now, technology is evolving so rapidly that new questions are being asked. And I am of the view that there are very real reasons why we want to make sure that government cannot just willy-nilly get into everybody’s iPhones that is full of -- or smartphones that are full of very personal information and very personal data. And let’s face it, the whole Snowden disclosure episode elevated people’s suspicions of this. So does popular culture, by the way, which makes it appear as if I'm in the Sit Room and I'm moving things -- 现在，技术发展得太快了，新的问题不断涌现。我认为，我们有非常充分的理由要确保政府不能随随便便就进入每个人的 iPhone——或者说智能手机——里面装满了非常私人的信息和非常个人的数据。说实话，整个斯诺登泄密事件加深了人们的这种疑虑。流行文化也起到了推波助澜的作用，让人们觉得好像我坐在战情室里就能操控一切——
Moderator Smith: You’ve been watching Homeland. 主持人史密斯：您是看了《国土安全》吧。
President Obama: There’s like half a fingerprint and half an hour later, I'm tracking the guy in the streets of Istanbul. 奥巴马总统：好像半个指纹加半小时，我就能在伊斯坦布尔街头追踪到那个人。
Moderator Smith: It's not really that cool? 主持人史密斯：没那么酷吗？
President Obama: It turns out it doesn’t work that way. Sometimes I'm just trying to get a connection. But, look, that was a real issue. I will say, by the way, that -- and I don't want to go too far afield -- but the Snowden issue vastly overstated the dangers to U.S. citizens in terms of spying, because the fact of the matter is, is that actually our intelligence agencies are pretty scrupulous about U.S. persons, people on U.S. soil. What those disclosures did identify were accesses overseas with respect to people who are not in this country. 奥巴马总统：事实证明不是那么回事儿。有时候我就是想连上网而已。但是，听着，那确实是个问题。顺便说一句，我得说——我不想扯太远——但斯诺登事件极大地夸大了美国公民在间谍活动方面面临的危险，因为事实是，我们的情报机构对美国境内的美国人其实是非常谨慎的。那些泄密真正揭露的是对海外不在美国境内的人的监控。
A lot of those have been fixed. Don't take my word for it. There was a panel that was constituted, an independent panel that just graded all the reforms that we set up to avoid those charges. 其中很多已经被修正了。别信我的话。有一个独立小组专门评估了我们为避免这些指控而设立的所有改革措施。
But I understand that that raised suspicions. All right. So we're concerned about privacy. We don't want government to be looking through everybody’s phones, willy-nilly, without any kind of oversight or probable cause or a clear sense that it's targeted at somebody who might be a wrong-doer. 但我理解这确实引发了疑虑。好吧。所以我们关心隐私。我们不希望政府随随便便就翻看每个人的手机，没有任何监督、没有合理理由、没有明确针对某个可能的不法分子。
What makes it even more complicated is the fact we also want really strong encryption, because part of us preventing terrorism, or preventing people from disrupting the financial system or our air traffic control system or a whole other set of systems that are increasingly digitalized is that hackers, state or non-state, can just get in there and mess them up. 让问题更复杂的是，我们也想要非常强的加密，因为我们要防止恐怖主义，防止人们破坏金融系统或空中交通管制系统，或者其他越来越数字化的系统，防止黑客——不管是国家支持的还是非国家的——闯进去搞破坏。
So we've got two values, both of which are important. Right? 所以我们有两种价值观，两者都很重要。对吧？
Moderator Smith: Right. 主持人史密斯：对。
President Obama: And the question we now have to ask is, if technologically, it is possible to make an impenetrable device or system where the encryption is so strong that there’s no key, there’s no door at all, then how do we apprehend the child pornographer? How do we solve or disrupt a terrorist plot? What mechanisms do we have available to even do simple things like tax enforcement? 奥巴马总统：我们现在必须问的问题是，如果从技术上讲，有可能制造出一个完全无法破解的设备或系统，加密强度高到没有密钥、根本没有入口，那我们怎么抓捕儿童色情制作者？怎么破获或挫败恐怖袭击？我们还有什么机制可以用来做税收执法这么简单的事情？
President Obama: Because, if, in fact, you can't crack that at all, government can't get in, then everybody is walking around with a Swiss bank account in their pocket -- right? So there has to be some concession to the need to be able to get into that information somehow. 奥巴马总统：因为，如果事实上你完全破解不了，政府进不去，那每个人口袋里都揣着一个瑞士银行账户了——对吧？所以必须做出一些让步，以某种方式能够获取这些信息。
Now, what folks who are on the encryption side will argue is any key whatsoever, even if it starts off as just being directed at one device could end up being used on every device. That's just the nature of these systems. That is a technical question. I'm not a software engineer. It is, I think, technically true, but I think it can be overstated. 现在，支持加密那一方的人会说，任何密钥都不行，哪怕一开始只针对一个设备，最后可能会用在所有设备上。这就是这些系统的特性。这是个技术问题。我不是软件工程师。我认为，技术上这是对的，但可能被夸大了。
And so the question now becomes, we as a society -- setting aside the specific case between the FBI and Apple, setting aside the commercial interests, concerns about what could the Chinese government do with this even if we trusted the U.S. government -- setting aside all those questions, we're going to have to make some decisions about how do we balance these respective risks. 所以现在的问题变成了，我们作为一个社会——撇开 FBI 和苹果之间的具体案件，撇开商业利益，撇开哪怕我们信任美国政府，中国政府会怎么利用这种能力的担忧——撇开所有这些问题，我们必须做出一些决定，如何平衡这些各自的风险。
And I've got a bunch of smart people sitting there, talking about it, thinking about it. We have engaged the tech community aggressively to help solve this problem. My conclusion so far is that you cannot take an absolutist view on this. So if your argument is strong encryption, no matter what, and we can and should, in fact, create black boxes, then that I think does not strike the kind of balance that we have lived with for 200, 300 years. And it's fetishizing our phones above every other value. And that can't be the right answer. 我有一群聪明人在研究这个问题，讨论这个问题，思考这个问题。我们积极邀请科技界参与帮助解决这个问题。我目前的结论是，你不能在这件事上采取绝对主义立场。所以如果你的论点是，无论如何都要强加密，我们能够而且应该创造黑箱，那么我认为这没有达到我们已经生活了两三百年的那种平衡。这是把我们的手机神化到凌驾于所有其他价值之上。这不可能是正确答案。
I suspect that the answer is going to come down to how do we create a system where the encryption is as strong as possible, the key is as secure as possible, it is accessible by the smallest number of people possible for a subset of issues that we agree are important. How we design that is not something that I have the expertise to do. 我猜想答案最终会归结为，我们如何创建一个系统，加密尽可能强，密钥尽可能安全，只有尽可能少的人能够访问，而且只针对我们一致认为重要的少数问题。如何设计这个系统不是我有专业知识能做的事。
But I caution -- I am way on the civil liberties side of this thing. Bill McRaven will tell you that I anguish a lot over the decisions we make in terms of how to keep this country safe, and I am not interested in overthrowing the values that have made us an exceptional and great nation simply for expediency. But the dangers are real. Maintaining law and order and a civilized society is important. Protecting our kids is important. And so I would just caution against taking an absolutist perspective on this. 但我要提醒一句——我在这件事上是非常偏向公民自由那一边的。比尔·麦克雷文会告诉你，对于我们为保护国家安全所做的决定，我有多么痛苦纠结，我不会为了权宜之计就推翻那些让我们成为一个伟大非凡国家的价值观。但危险是真实存在的。维护法律和秩序、维护文明社会很重要。保护我们的孩子很重要。所以我只是告诫大家不要在这个问题上采取绝对主义的立场。
Because we make compromises all the time. I haven't flown commercial in a while -- but my understanding is it's not great fun -- 因为我们一直在做出妥协。我有一阵子没坐民航了——但我知道那不是什么愉快的体验——
Moderator Smith: It's not great. It's not great. 主持人史密斯：确实不愉快。真的不愉快。
President Obama: -- going through security. But we make the concession because -- it's a big intrusion on our privacy, but we recognize it as important. We have stops for drunk drivers. It's an intrusion, but we think it's the right thing to do. And this notion that somehow our data is different and can be walled off from those other tradeoffs we make I believe is incorrect. 奥巴马总统：——过安检。但我们做出了让步，因为——这是对我们隐私的很大侵犯，但我们认为这很重要。我们设有酒驾检查站。这也是一种侵犯，但我们认为这是正确的做法。那种认为我们的数据不知为何与众不同，可以跟我们做出的其他所有权衡隔离开来的想法，我认为是不对的。
We do have to make sure, given the power of the Internet and how much our lives are digitalized, that it is narrow and it is constrained and that there’s oversight. And I'm confident this is something that we can solve. But we're going to need the tech community -- software designers, people who care deeply about this stuff -- to help us solve it. 我们确实必须确保，鉴于互联网的力量以及我们生活的数字化程度，这种访问必须是有限的、受约束的，而且有监督机制。我有信心我们能解决这个问题。但我们需要科技界——软件设计师、深深关心这些事情的人们——帮助我们解决它。
Because what will happen is if everybody goes to their respective corners and the tech community says, you know what, either we have strong, perfect encryption, or else it's Big Brother and an Orwellian world -- what you’ll find is that after something really bad happens, the politics of this will swing and it will become sloppy and rushed, and it will go through Congress in ways that have not been thought through. 因为如果每个人都退到自己的角落，科技界说，你知道吗，要么我们有强大完美的加密，要么就是老大哥和奥威尔式的世界——你会发现，当真的发生什么糟糕的事情之后，政治风向就会转变，然后就会草率仓促行事，国会就会通过一些未经深思熟虑的法案。
And then you really will have dangers to our civil liberties because we will have not done -- the people who understand this best and who care most about privacy and civil liberties have sort of disengaged or taken a position that is not sustainable for the general public as a whole over time. 到那时候，我们的公民自由才真的会面临危险，因为我们没有——那些最了解这个问题、最关心隐私和公民自由的人，要么已经置身事外，要么采取了一种从长远来看对整个公众来说不可持续的立场。
Moderator Smith: Sadly, Mr. President, the clock is telling me that we're out of time. A lot of things I wanted to ask you. You gave a great answer on that question, and I'm happy to have that be the last bit that we did together. Thank you so much for being here. 主持人史密斯：遗憾的是，总统先生，时钟告诉我时间到了。我还有好多问题想问您。您对那个问题的回答非常精彩，我很高兴这是我们最后交流的内容。非常感谢您来到这里。
President Obama: I'm the President, so I'm going to take one more minute. 奥巴马总统：我是总统，所以我要再多说一分钟。
Moderator Smith: You will? We'll take it. 主持人史密斯：是吗？我们洗耳恭听。
President Obama: There are a number of different ways in which all of you can plug into what I've been talking about here today. So if you are interested in figuring out ways to make government services work better, you can go to whitehouse.gov or U.S. Digital Services and find out what they’re doing. If you are interested in how we can make sure that classrooms are properly connected, you can plug into what we're doing with ConnectED. 奥巴马总统：你们有很多不同的方式可以参与我今天谈到的这些事情。所以如果你有兴趣想办法让政府服务运转得更好，可以去 whitehouse.gov 或者美国数字服务局的网站，看看他们在做什么。如果你有兴趣了解我们如何确保教室都能联网，可以参与我们的"连接教育"项目。
One of my favorite projects that’s just gotten started over the last several months is -- diapers are really expensive, and we've actually set up a system whereby through social media and the Internet, non-for-profits are able to make bulk purchases of diapers, save 25 percent on those, so that they can distribute them to low-income moms and families. And it's a convergence of diaper makers and logistics companies and Internet companies. And we sort of convened the thing, but it's not running through a government program. 我最喜欢的一个项目是最近几个月才启动的——纸尿裤真的很贵，我们实际上建立了一个系统，通过社交媒体和互联网，非营利组织能够批量采购纸尿裤，节省 25% 的费用，这样它们就能分发给低收入妈妈和家庭。这是纸尿裤生产商、物流公司和互联网公司的结合。我们起到了召集的作用，但这不是通过政府项目运作的。
So whatever your interests are, whatever your passions are, whatever your concerns are, we need you. And I want to underscore the fact that in 10 months I will not have this office. It has been the great privilege of my life, but it's not like I stop caring about the things that I care about right now. And it's not like I'm going to stop being involved in promoting the best, most prosperous, most peaceful, most tolerant, most ecologically responsible America that I can. 所以无论你的兴趣是什么，无论你的热情在哪里，无论你关心什么，我们都需要你。我想强调的是，10 个月后我就不再担任这个职务了。这是我一生中最大的荣幸，但我不会就此不再关心我现在在乎的事情。我也不会停止参与推动建设一个最繁荣、最和平、最包容、最具生态责任感的美国。
I'll be sitting in an audience with you -- and I expect you to step up and get involved, because the country needs you. And if the brainpower and talent that's on display here today and throughout this conference takes up that baton, then I'm going to be really confident about the future of this country. 我会和你们一起坐在观众席上——我期待你们站出来参与进来，因为国家需要你们。如果今天和整个大会上展示出来的智慧和才华接过这根接力棒，那么我对这个国家的未来就会非常有信心。
All right. Thank you, guys. 好的。谢谢大家。